Brissy Riders Club
The #1 Motorbike forum for Brisbane and SE QLD Based Riders. Ride Days, Socials, Tech Days, BBQ's and much much more! |
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ARQANGEL
650+ Posts! NoS Charged
Age : 98
Joined : 19 Apr 2008
Posts : 883
Location : Planet Bite My Ass
Name : Some Guy
What bike do you ride? : Suzuki K6 GSX-R 1000
|  Subject: Re: Suggestion BoX  Wed Apr 23, 2008 9:45 pm | |
| | Magnets and Stickers. There's so many bikes at my gym without any club tags on them. Just an idea to get the word out. |
|   | | ZR6
Admin
Age : 30
Joined : 16 Apr 2008
Posts : 1819
Location : Brisbane
Name : Zayd
What bike do you ride? : R6 '06
| | Subject: Re: Suggestion BoX Wed Apr 23, 2008 10:10 pm | |
| | ARQANGEL wrote: | | Magnets and Stickers. There's so many bikes at my gym without any club tags on them. Just an idea to get the word out. |
1 of 2 things you've just suggested are / is on it's way. Cheers
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| | | | ARQANGEL
650+ Posts! NoS Charged
Age : 98
Joined : 19 Apr 2008
Posts : 883
Location : Planet Bite My Ass
Name : Some Guy
What bike do you ride? : Suzuki K6 GSX-R 1000
| | Subject: Re: Suggestion BoX Thu Apr 24, 2008 5:50 am | |
| | Do you have to be a L-Plate Squid to start new threads in this Forum? |
| | | | ZR6
Admin
Age : 30
Joined : 16 Apr 2008
Posts : 1819
Location : Brisbane
Name : Zayd
What bike do you ride? : R6 '06
| | Subject: Re: Suggestion BoX Thu Apr 24, 2008 9:13 am | |
| | ARQANGEL wrote: | | Do you have to be a L-Plate Squid to start new threads in this Forum? |
Umm I'm a bit unsure of your question?
Do you think the status aren't right etc, prefer them renamed?
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| | | | Guest
Guest
| | Subject: Re: Suggestion BoX Thu Apr 24, 2008 10:35 am | |
| | He was asking if you need a higher rank to start a thread.... No Geoff, if you want to start a new thread on a 'bare' topic, click on the little red notebook, its the start new topic button. |
| | | | Bear
Catch me if u can
Age : 30
Joined : 18 Apr 2008
Posts : 575
Location : Calamvale
Name : Matt Baillie
What bike do you ride? : 05 R6S Raven
| | Subject: Re: Suggestion BoX Thu Apr 24, 2008 11:07 am | |
| How about a How To Section where members can ask, post topics about appearance mods, power mods, ect... Say like the how to replace your stock Air Filter with an Aftermarket one..
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| | | | ZR6
Admin
Age : 30
Joined : 16 Apr 2008
Posts : 1819
Location : Brisbane
Name : Zayd
What bike do you ride? : R6 '06
| | Subject: Re: Suggestion BoX Thu Apr 24, 2008 11:44 am | |
| | CBR4LYFE wrote: | | He was asking if you need a higher rank to start a thread.... No Geoff, if you want to start a new thread on a 'bare' topic, click on the little red notebook, its the start new topic button. |
k I've added text to the little red notebook, should make it easier to spot now
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| | | | Guest
Guest
| | Subject: Re: Suggestion BoX Thu Apr 24, 2008 4:05 pm | |
| | Bear wrote: | | How about a How To Section where members can ask, post topics about appearance mods, power mods, ect... Say like the how to replace your stock Air Filter with an Aftermarket one.. |
Hey bear,
Please do start a thread! Put it in the tech tips section under wrenches spanners etc.
Cheers
Ron |
| | | | Guest
Guest
| | Subject: Re: Suggestion BoX Tue Apr 29, 2008 7:20 pm | |
| Just some constructive critique from another forum owner here  Calling yourself a club, and making riders sign a waiver on rides could possibly make things very complicated for yourselves.
All motorcycle forums hold rides, and there are no legal requirements to sign waivers 
As soon as you call yourself a club, thats where the legal problems can start ... be careful guys. |
| | | | Guest
Guest
| | Subject: Re: Suggestion BoX Tue Apr 29, 2008 8:52 pm | |
| | We're aware of that, but if an invite is sent out from a "club", accepted by another rider and they crash on a ride organised by the "club" (for lack of a better suiting term), there have been cases where those involved have sued. Call me crazy but we dont plan on paying anyone anything who crashes on any of our rides. Its merely letting riders take responsibility for their actions, why do people have a problem with this? I wouldnt give a shit if i had to sign one for anyone else. |
| | | | Bear
Catch me if u can
Age : 30
Joined : 18 Apr 2008
Posts : 575
Location : Calamvale
Name : Matt Baillie
What bike do you ride? : 05 R6S Raven
| | Subject: Re: Suggestion BoX Wed Apr 30, 2008 12:02 am | |
| Seriously, Whats the problem with the waiver? All you have to do is add your sig at the bottom of the supplied form, bring it allong and you ride with the others who dont have a problem with the waiver. If you dont want to sign the form then stay at home and dont associate yourselves with the "Club" The guys have put too much time into getting this off the ground to deal with petty qaurrells....
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| | | | Bear
Catch me if u can
Age : 30
Joined : 18 Apr 2008
Posts : 575
Location : Calamvale
Name : Matt Baillie
What bike do you ride? : 05 R6S Raven
| | Subject: Re: Suggestion BoX Wed Apr 30, 2008 12:22 am | |
| How about a jokes thread???Cause hell I need some jokes from time to time...
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| | | | Guest
Guest
| | Subject: Issues with Ride Liability Waivers! Please Read! Wed Apr 30, 2008 12:56 am | |
| | Lucky wrote: | Just some constructive critique from another forum owner here Calling yourself a club, and making riders sign a waiver on rides could possibly make things very complicated for yourselves.
All motorcycle forums hold rides, and there are no legal requirements to sign waivers
As soon as you call yourself a club, thats where the legal problems can start ... be careful guys. |
Hey Lucky and everyone else interested in this topic. There seem to be one of 2 posters that have been taking issue with our waiver policy. So I'm gonna get all serious for a bit and on that note, I wanted to write something in depth about this and our reasons at the BRC for implementing the ride waiver.
In understand that there are other groups out there that don't have a waiver! I have also been on a bunch of rides with QMRF as well as other groups and I never had to sign a waiver either. And that doesn’t mean that there is a hard and fast rule against waivers being implemented within rider clubs and forums.
Personally and professionally I believe that QMRF, Ozmoto and the rest of the groups out there not implementing a waiver should do so for their own collective protection. A simple stop gap measure like a waiver that takes a few min to read and 2 seconds to sign, is well worth it! I’ll explain why.
We established this waiver based on legal advise and good sense. It not only protects the BRC admin, it also protects all the members that participate in rides. We are all adults and get together to have a nice time, go on rides and gather for social events, and we should be able to assume that all participants have taken the care to ensure they are qualified to do the activity, and have the proper gear and serviced bike for their own safety, and if they choose to do a mono, or speed excessively that they will do it at their own risk! It’s a form that just clearly states that you as a rider and participant know this, and acknowledge it ! takes 2 min and doesn’t ask for your 1st born, or your bike, or your brand new Shoei. Its to ensure that you accept responsibility for yourself! Pretty Simple! If you think otherwise, take some time to go to the gallery, download and print one, and read it. You will notice its pretty straight forward.
A bit of stuff about me. Im in my last semester of a Post Graduate law degree. Ive worked in the legal industry for quite some time, consulted at a personal injury law firm and been involved in insurance claim administration before. So my experience is pretty wide and varied when it comes to people suing others for a various bunch of reasons including injury!
What Im going to try and do here is sort of get everyone up to speed on the issues of legal liability, I wanted to give you a quick and dirty run down of how personal injury (tort) lawsuits go. ***NOTE*** this is in no way my personal opinion, and the discussion of how morally right or wrong these laws are, and the debate about whether thieves breaking into homes and injuring themselves should be able to sue the homeowner. That debate is ongoing and for another time and place!
What Im going to spell out here is the legal REALITY regarding liability. And there There are 2 main concepts, that the courts and the lawyers use to determine liability
The first is something called the duty of care. The duty of care is basically the understanding that we have a responsibility to our nieghbors, or anyone that can be effected by us to ensure that we don’t do anything or contribute to them being injured or damaged in any way.
The second thing is reasonable forseeability. Now bike riding is an inherently dangerous thing, (which is one of the reasons I like riding ) and it is reasonably forseeable that someone could get seriously injured on a ride..
Potentially as members the BRC, or as organizers of rides, we then have a duty of care towards ride participants. This means that we could be expected to check drivers licenses to ensure that everyone is qualified to be riding the machine they are on, to check their helmets for standard stickers, ask them for their insurance papers, do our best to make sure they arent drunk blah blah blah.
We could, without a waiver, be held partailly responsible to ensure that we checked this stuff. Now I don’t know about you but I don’t want to baby sit anyone, Im not a cop, Im not a mechanic, Im not doing breath testing, or license checks and Im certainly not willing to be a parent to someone on a ride, and you shouldn’t be either.. I want to go on rides and have fun with a bunch of cool people that all accept that they are adults, and are responsible enough for themselves.. After all if they are careless about their own safety how can I expect them to be concerned about mine?
Ok so say Navigator or perhaps even you as a member, organizes a ride on the BRC, and it no longer is a bunch of people that met on the side or the road, but an organized ride. Then as usual, members coming along to participate and want to help out for example by taking head counts, establishing the ride leaders, the tail end charlies and anyone else that might help to make sure the ride goes smoothly. In this case, each person then becomes an organizer and sort of leader on the ride, or a person of authority within the club, and that ride in particular.
Then 2 days before the ride Mr Joe Fuckwit decides to join the BRC and comes on the ride. And say we DID NOT implemented a waiver policy. Mr Fuckwit, shows up and fails to mention that he hasn’t serviced his brakes and is in serious need of a pad replacement, and during the ride, he goes around a bend on Nebo or Tamborine, and goes off the edge when he cant slow down. He gets seriously injured or even dies. Now all of a sudden he (if he lived) or his parents, his children, his wife, or whoever, who is feeling a loss of someone they love, or even more base, miss his income and they will want answers and some sort of relief. Here is where a lawyer comes in. They are going to want to know why that happened and if anyone else was partially responsible for his situation…how he got there, and all the factors that contributed to his accident. The lawyer as any good lawyer will start to examine ALL the facts on the case! And all that are potentially involved. So maybe his mechanic. And definitely the BRC.
So now the eyes are on the BRC. And that means all of us! You can bet that as admins, moderators, leaders, organizers, tail end charlies, people responsible for headcounts and directions etc will be assumed to have a duty of care towards the ride partcipants. You can also bet that they will determine that it was reasonably forseeable that someone may get injured on a ride. It does happen a lot.
So now you get served with a court summons. You have to get a lawyer, pay him a lot of money to defend you, take the day or days off work, and go thru all the stress and hassle of fighting a case, that you may lose! Then whammo the judge looks at the facts and awards damages to the Fuckwits.. and as a member of the BRC, you are found responsible!! And all of a sudden you have to sell your bike, take on a 2nd job, or whatever to pay for the damages. Think this couldn’t happen? Think of the thief that sued the owner for an injury he sustained while breaking into someone’s house and won!. I can give you many more examples!
I don’t know about you.. I don’t way to be paying for lawyers, having the stress of going to court, and having my hard earned money taken away cuase Mr Fuckwit didn’t take responsibility for his own safety and stuck it on us! Not when this can all be avoided with a waiver!
Professionally, let me tell you, if there really was a Joe Fuckwit, he WOULD have a case, and the waiver would make BRC and its collective membership very difficult to pursue!
This is the reason a waiver is a good idea! As Adam has stated, other riders on other rides have sued the organizers for their injuries! So, we arent taking chances. Its BRC policy! and really not debateable.
And personally, and I think you will agree with me, that anyone that doesn’t want to sign the waiver, is probably somebody I don’t want to be along on a BRC ride with anyway. I’m signing one, and Im an almost lawyer! LOL yep almost a shark, snake whatever you want to call me, and Im making sense! Im willing to take on responsibility for myself and to ensure you that I wont find you liable for my stupidity.
So, friends, potential friends, ride participants, and BRC forum members, It’s a simple form, print it out! It lets us know you are going to assume responsibility for yourself and you are licensed to ride the bike you are on, and wont be suing any of the rest of us if you get injured doing something you voluntarily chose to do! We are here as friends to do the right thing and watch out for someone in the group just like one of your buddies would. If we notice something wrong with the bike, we wont say something.. Just don’t make us responsible for you!!
Yes, the BRC may be the first riding forum based group to implement one of these forms, however others such as Pro motorcycles also make people sign waivers before rides. It just makes good sense!
Now, Im a pretty easy going guy, and so is Zed, and Adam, and we started this forum and group so that we could ride with others, organize social events, and go do fun stuff!!
Easy going and all, I will say this, if any of us are there on a ride and someone shows up without a waiver signed and then refuses to sign one before we depart, you can bet I will be telling the person they cant participate, and then they can either go home, or lurk in the background like a shameless idiot cause they wont be riding with us, or be welcome to our events in the future. No Waiver, No BRC Ride. Pretty simple it’s a firm BRC policy.
To quote Adam, we arent putting a gun to your head! You have a choice to not sign the form.. However that choice means non-partipation in a BRC ride! There are other rides out there, that don’t ask for waivers, I am sure you will be able to ride with them, unless they see the light and get one too!
So again, the Waiver is BRC Policy and Non Debatable! Now that you know our policy, please adhere to it!! And lets have a good time out there! So Lucky, the waiver IS us being careful!
Cheers
Ronno
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| | | | Guest
Guest
| | Subject: Re: Suggestion BoX Wed Apr 30, 2008 3:11 pm | |
| Longest post in the world...  .... but ramming home a point often leads to an essay that reiterates and reinforces our point of view. Well done on the serious moment Ron, i bet your head hurts  But true to form if im on the ride and you dont sign, i wont be letting you ride with us  |
| | | | Pugs313
P Plater
Joined : 19 Apr 2008
Posts : 75
Location : Brisbane = Sth Side
Name : Jeff
What bike do you ride? : Kawasaki ZX12R
| | Subject: Re: Suggestion BoX Wed Apr 30, 2008 3:24 pm | |
| My sore eyes .. I think I have damaged my one good eye on the above  ... Sad to think that people with good intentions have to run the risk of someone suing them... Give me the paper and I will put my X on it for ya 
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